Traveller-digest     Thursday, October 14 1999     Volume 1999 : Number 1208



(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.
All rights reserved.

The following topics are covered in this digest:

RE: Bigger ammo clips (and Slang in Trav)
Re: Spraying near-c-rocks-B-gone liberally
Re: Spraying near-c-rocks-B-gone liberally
Re: Bigger ammo clips
Re: Bigger ammo clips
Re: Tracers (was: Ammo Conservation)
RE: Population Growth
Hyperrealistic game play
RE: Population Growth
RE: Norris the Man
RE: Heplar Efficiency
RE: Population Growth
Re: Norris the Man
Re: Lucan the Man...
Gas-Powered Computers?
re: Population Growth
RE: Population Growth
Re: Population Growth
Re: The Near C Rock Accords II 

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 12:34:38 +0100
From: "Trevor, Peter" <Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com>
Subject: RE: Bigger ammo clips (and Slang in Trav)

From: Douglas E. Berry
> One of my favorites was "Echo, Tango, Suitcase!"  ETS was the
> day you were schedules to leave the Army.

Not a military expression but one used by the British  police  in
high speed pursuits (etc) is "Golf Lima Foxtrot". This translates
as "go like f***!", and means to drive very fast.



Regards PLST
"Rome wasn't burned in a day."

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 02:52:41 PST
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)
Subject: Re: Spraying near-c-rocks-B-gone liberally

In mail you write:

>> Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 18:59:45 PST
>> From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)
>> 
>> The thing is, HEPlar, or even a more reasonable fusion rocket only
>> requires you to "watch fuel" *closely* if you try doing "absurd" things
>> with it. Like making normal space trips longer than a week.
>
> Why's more than a week absurd?  For a 1-G vessel, doing the accel-flip-
> decel mission profile,
>
>   d = 2 * (0.5 * a * (t/2)**2)
>     = a * t**2 / 4
>
> Which, for a = 10 m/s^2 and t = 1 week = 604800 s, results in a distance
> travelled of 914457600000 m, or 914,457,600 km, or roughly 6 AU.  This is
> a typical distance for e.g. trips between habitable worlds and inner gas
> giants, or from one part of an asteroid belt to another -- which are
> surely among the most common in-system trip types.
>
> Even in a 2-G vessel, the trip range only increases to 12 AU, still quite
> normal for inner-system-to-nearest-GG trips.  And remember that for some
> such you may want or need to keep reserve fuel as well.

It's absurd, because in most cases you can do an in-system "microjump"
to cover the same distance in only a week. If you can't do a jump due
to lack of fuel, spending a week using what's left at a high rate isn't
the brightest thing in the world. 

And check out the velocity at turnover for a constant boost trip of
"only" a week:

g	V (km/s)	V (%c)
- --	--------	------
1	 3,024		1.008
2	 6,048		2.016
3	 9,072		3.024
4	12,096		4.032
5	15,120		5.040
6	18,144		6.048

At these speeds *dust* is a deadly hazard. And stray hydrogen atoms
hitting the hull may be a significant radiation hazard.

- -- 
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 03:08:33 PST
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)
Subject: Re: Spraying near-c-rocks-B-gone liberally

In mail you write:

>> Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 11:39:33 -0700 (PDT)
>> From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com>
>> 
>> Craig Berry writes:
>>  
>> > Why's more than a week absurd?  For a 1-G vessel, doing the accel-flip-
>> > decel mission profile,
>>
>> Because by and large you might as well jump?
>
> (Douglas, please remind me to add a footnote on David Lee Roth to the
> "Elvis is Yaskodray" essay.)
>
> Yes, if you're in a jump-capable vessel (and have the fuel).  For many
> purposes this is massive overkill.  A lot of in-system traffic is going to
> use far less expensive no-jump boats even for multi-week trips, with "jump
> service" as an expensive alternative, sort of like flying the Concorde
> across the Atlantic.

>> Because 84 G-hours is 1% of lightspeed and you're going to have dust
>> grains punching holes in your ship?
>
> Possibly valid reaction.  Given that from earliest canon (LBB 2) the
> thruster-enabled accel-flip-decel profile has been standard, implied canon
> is that Trav hulls can take a little .01c dust without doing more than
> scouring the paint a bit.

At 9e9 J for a 1 mg dust grain (assuming .1 c), that's a *lot* of
"scouring". About 2 *tons* of TNT equivalent. So unless you want to
revise weapons power upwards by a *lot*, this will be a problem.

>> Because any reaction engine capable of a G-week has insane performance? 
>
> This is the kicker.  Yes, of course it does.  That's why you don't get to
> fly accel-flip-decel profiles in a HEPlaR vessel.  But again, a-f-d
> profiles are both canonical and (IMHO) part of the trav 'feel' -- which
> thus requires recourse to magic t-plates, which violate conservation laws
> and turn every lifeboat into a potential planet-cracker.  That's the
> dilemma. 

At least back in the LBB days, I always just assumed that there was an
unspoken "if you have enough fuel" for those profiles.

>> Not sure of overall density of interplanetary dust, but a 1 milligram
>> dust particle at 84 G-hours speed has an energy of 4.5 megajoules with
>> better focus than any laser, and should be able to punch holes in your
>> average unarmored craft without difficulty. 
>
> You'd think so, wouldn't you?  Good thing about that ultrahard unobtainium
> alloy they use for hulls...shame it's no good against lasers, or even
> missiles...just dust. :)

Alas, it *can't be good against "dust" and not good against other
kinetic impacts.

- -- 
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 03:26:00 PST
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)
Subject: Re: Bigger ammo clips

In mail you write:

> On 12 Oct 99, at 15:02, Leonard Erickson wrote:
>
>> In mail you write:
>> 
>> First problem is that the extra weight can do nasty things to the
>> magazine catch. Like cause it to fail, dropping a partially used
>> magazine at an inconvenient moment. Or to jam, making it impossible to
>> remove an empty. 
>
> I can imagine this happening with a pistol, but not with most military 
> rifles.

Remember that the weapon was likely designed for the 30 round magazine,
not that monster "drum". Then consider that regardless of the actual
specs, it was *supplied* by the lowest bidder...

>> The above is based on personal experience dealing with two different
>> purchases of "bulk" ammo for the SKS. I'm sure similar situations apply
>> with other weapons and ammo. 
>
> Some of the cheaper 5.56mm ammo comes in 20 round boxes and loading a 
> whole lot of 30 round mags is really time consuming, boring and hard on 
> the fingers.
>  
>> Anyway, sometimes "cheap" can get *real* expensive (like trying to
>> reload magazines by hand while under fire).
>
> Try rebuilding an MG link in this sort of situation because the 
> resupply was of loose rifle ammo only. Fortunately it was only an 
> exercise...

Ouch! I never thought of *that* possibility. Just trying to find links
that handn't been stepped on would be a chore. I bet you longed for the
old days when the "beltes" were actual *cloth*. :-)

I do hope that the after action analysis had appropriately nasty things
to say to supply?

- -- 
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 03:31:41 PST
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)
Subject: Re: Bigger ammo clips

In mail you write:

> (For the _truly_ uninitiated, "FTA" is short for "F**k The Army".  One
> may note that, in my Basic Training "SMART" book [I forget what the
> acronym means, but it's a book of common soldier information], one could
> have found "FTA", neatly inscribed in pencil, in such diverse places as
> the bore evacuators of drawings of Soviet tanks and the front of
> drawings of Claymore mines.)

> ObTrav:  If any slang acronyms from the modern US Army survive in the
> 3I, I would expect "FTA" and "FIGMO" ["F**k It, Got My Orders" (either
> to change stations or to leave the service)] to be among them.  Other
> possible surviving acronyms would be "FIDO" [F**k It, Drive On] and
> BOHICA ["Bend Over, Here It Comes Again"].

IHTDFP - "I Have This Day Found Paradise" (or so you calim to anybody
"official") Atually means "I Hate This Damn F**king Place"

And SNAFU is already part of the general language. So is FUBAR.

JANFU - Joint Army-Navy F**K Up

- -- 
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 03:36:25 PST
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)
Subject: Re: Tracers (was: Ammo Conservation)

In mail you write:

> On 12 Oct 99, at 16:57, Leonard Erickson wrote:
>
>> One possiblity (that risks ruining the weapon) would be for "rail gun"
>> type weapons to fire titanium projectiles and somehow ignite them
>> (preferabbly as they leave the barrel! :-).
>> 
>> That would provide a nice tracer effect, and possibly make a decent
>> incendiary round. Especially from larger caliber weapons. :-)
>
> Other igniteable metals you could use include depleted uranium. I can 
> see it now: APFSDSDU-TI (Armour Piercing Fin Stabilised Discarding 
> Sabot Depleted Uranium - Tracer Incendiary).

Not anyplace yyou want the troopies breathing the air. Uranium, being a
heavy metal makes Uranium Oxide dust something you'd really rather not
inhale. 

Titanium isn't that dense (about half as dense as plain steel), but
TiO2 is *very* inert. The worst you'd get from inhaling it is
silicosis, if the particles were big enough. The naval smoke screens
use TiCl4, which reacts with the water in the air to form indiviual
molecules of TiO2 "dust" in the air. It takes *very* little to produce
insane amounts of "smoke".

But Ti is the original "hard to put out" fire. Once started, it'll not
only burn in oxygen, it'll burn in *nitrogen*. In air you get 20% TiO2,
and 80% Ti3N4(?). It'll pull the oxygen out of water or CO2. If try to
smother it, it'll pull the oxygen out of concrete and sand! That is,
it'll try to burn the floor/ground if it can't get any air. 

There are two ways to deal with burning titanium.

1. move other materials away from it (or vice versa) and let it burn out.
2. bury it in "sand" composed of stuff like TiO2 that it *can't* burn.

Oh yeah, just for kicks, here's my "Saboteur's Friend"TM incendiary device.

Take a bar of titanium. Plate it (or dip coat it) with a layer of
magnesium, to make it easier to light. Plate *that* with sodium or
other easy to ignite material that will react with water to start the
reaction (ie water ignites sodium, which ignites magnesium, which
ignites titanium). Coat this with something water soluble that doesn't
react with sodium.

Form to look like metal scraps, rocks, etc. Any sort of junk that you'd
expect to see accumulated in odd corners outdoors. 

Casually stroll thru warehouse district or supply depot, and toss into
dark corners, were water will accumulate next time it rains. Roof topos
are good. 

Be long gone when the rainstorm arrives a day or too later, and all the
"mysterious fires" take out the critical supplies. :-)

- -- 
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 10:00:32 -0400
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca>
Subject: RE: Population Growth

Rupert Boleyn writes:
<snipped>
>In your example above with 10 adults if they were pre-industrial
>farmers they could really only support 2 or maybe 3 non-productive
>children, so whether 5 were women or 9 were women wouldn't really
>matter. Though having only 1 male would make the community very
>vulnerable to accident.

	Your point is well made.  The original poster had presented
	a scenario in which (if I understood it correctly) the
	population might have grown from an initial group of about
	20 teenagers.  How realistic this would be should depend on
	the background of the youngsters, the resources available
	in their downed vessel, and the environment that they find
	themselves in.  Thus, the rate of increase may be 0 or even
	negative, but the general formula could still apply (except
	that, as I mentioned earlier, the age structure and small
	size of the initial population are problems).

>BTW a great many bird species rely quite heavily on the male's
>contribution to raise the young.

	Absolutely, as do some other animals (I can think of a couple
	mammals of mammals, some insects, not much else).  Of course,
	in all these dioecious organisms (having separate sexes), 
	reproduction is impossible without males, but population
	biologists tend to simplify things by assuming that there are
	sufficient males to mate with/feed/support the females in the
	population.  This greatly reduces the complexity of the
	calculations involved without hindering their relevance.

Peez

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 10:02:34 -0400
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca>
Subject: Hyperrealistic game play

Glenn writes:
>That's at least three of us with similar ideas (you, me, and
>Peez).  Maybe we really do have to get going on this.

	Yup.

Peez

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 15:58:07 +0100
From: Timothy.Collinson@solent.ac.uk
Subject: RE: Population Growth

Rupert Boleyn <paradise.net.nz> wrote:


>I agree with you. What I was (trying to) point out was that in a hunter-
>gastherer, or (especially) a primitive agricultural society there is
>something else - a limited food supply. In your example above with 10
>adults if they were pre-industrial farmers they could really only
>support 2 or maybe 3 non-productive children, so whether 5 were women
>or 9 were women wouldn't really matter.


I'm presuming the world they're on (or bit of it that they're inhabiting at
any rate) is so Edenic that the 'survivor kids' as someone dubbed them
would have no problem eating.  The idea was to have the population increase
as rapidly as their limited numbers (and high infant mortality rate) would
allow.  I'm presuming that food can be abundant in a completely
untouched-by-humans landscape and that the little nutritional knowledge
they have would ensure something of a balanced diet.

Assuming that they have next to no ability to hunt for meat (at least at
first - I reckon they'd learn swiftly), that would leave fruit, nuts,
vegetables, berries, fungi...

Anything obvious I've missed?

Anything exotic/SFish anyone's used in Traveller situations like this?

(Let's grant for the moment there's nothing toxic in the vicinity or they
can identify it if so.)




>Though having only 1 male would
>make the community very vulnerable to accident.


I can see that could be a snag!



While I'm here, many thanks to all those who helped with the
breast-feeding/contraception info.


tc

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 22:59:06 -0700
From: "Antony Farrell" <Skaran@bigpond.com>
Subject: RE: Norris the Man

How did this myth that Norris was a stickler for legality arrived. Isn't he
the man who made himself archduke of Deneb without Strephons knowledge.
Strephon later confirmed it however.
Then there was the problem of an imperial warrant during the FFW. Norris did
not let things get in the way of his vision.

Antony Farrell

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 22:59:07 -0700
From: "Antony Farrell" <Skaran@bigpond.com>
Subject: RE: Heplar Efficiency

> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Anthony
> Jackson
> Sent: Wednesday, 13 October 1999 9:39 AM
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com
> Subject: Re: Heplar Efficiency
>
>
> Antony Farrell writes:
> > If people think Heplar thrusters are too efficient the solution seems
> > simple, just increase the fuel consumption for a given thrust. Doubling
> > fuel consumption immediately halves the drives efficiency. In any case
> > trying to fit 40 GHrs of fuel in some ships can be a real challenge.
>
> Reasonable realistic fuel consumption is about 100x (4,000
> seconds).  If you wanted to be very optimistic, 10x is probably
> fair, but in that case you should consider CG to be mandatory on
> any ship intended to ever land on a planet, HEPlaR is far too
> dangerous to use near other objects.  For close-in manuevering
> thrusters (docking and the like), I'd probably assume that the
> HEPlaR thrusters can be tuned down.
>
> As for 40 G-hours -- you do realize you can reach any location in
> the solar system on <1 G-hour of fuel?
>
I sure do, but I like to arrive relatively fresh, eating starship food for
weeks to months on a minimum fuel transfer orbit well it just wouldnt be the
same.
Antony

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 08:12:18 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kiri Aradia Morgan <tiamat@tsoft.com>
Subject: RE: Population Growth

On Thu, 14 Oct 1999, Rupert Boleyn wrote:

> On 12 Oct 99, at 11:08, Ian Ferguson wrote:
> 
> >  generation.  In humans, males do contribute to their
> >  offspring, but that does not mean that women are helpless
> >  without men to feed them and their children.  I would 
> >  certainly expect that 9 women with 1 man could produce more
> >  children than 5 women with 5 men, unless the number of 
> >  children is restricted by something else.
> 
> I agree with you. What I was (trying to) point out was that in a hunter-
> gastherer, or (especially) a primitive agricultural society there is 
> something else - a limited food supply. In your example above with 10 
> adults if they were pre-industrial farmers they could really only 
> support 2 or maybe 3 non-productive children, so whether 5 were women 
> or 9 were women wouldn't really matter. Though having only 1 male would 
> make the community very vulnerable to accident.
> 

I am a woman.  If someone told me that I had to share Hiroshi with one or
two other women, I could maybe deal with it.  I wouldn't like it, but
socialization in such a culture could overcome that.  But there is a
reason why even Islam limits a man to four WIVES.

If I had to share him with nine other women, someone's head would roll
eventually.  It might be mine or it might not.  There is a limit to a
man's attention and time; that's why wealthy men with harems had to guard
them so carefully and encourage lesbian behavior among the incarcerated.  
In other words, there are more factors here than just how many men are
needed to protect how many women and how much a male's contribution to
childrearing is needed.

I know quite a few women who could handle being wife #2 or #3 in a society
where women shared labor; it would mean they'd have some time to do things
for themselves.  I know of no one who would want to be wife #9.

Kiri  =)

******************************************************************************
Kiri Aradia Morgan                                  93!  Thou Art God
tiamat@tsoft.com

"If time passes, everything turns into beauty
If the rains stop, tears clean the scars of memory away
Everything starts wearing fresh colors
Every sound begins playing a heartfelt melody
Jealousy embellishes a page of the epic
Desire is embraced in a dream..."              -- X-JAPAN 

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 08:12:05 -0700
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com>
Subject: Re: Norris the Man

What was the problem with the Imperial Warrant? I thought the scenario was
that Norris led a dangerous expedition to an interdicted system to recover
the lost warant, possibly placing himself at risk for violating the
interdiction if the expedition failed. With a warrant in hand, pretty much
anything goes. Remember the Three Musketeeers?

Luther Martin
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Antony Farrell <Skaran@bigpond.com>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com>
Sent: Thursday, October 14, 1999 10:59 PM
Subject: RE: Norris the Man


>
> How did this myth that Norris was a stickler for legality arrived. Isn't
he
> the man who made himself archduke of Deneb without Strephons knowledge.
> Strephon later confirmed it however.
> Then there was the problem of an imperial warrant during the FFW. Norris
did
> not let things get in the way of his vision.
>
> Antony Farrell
>

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 11:21:53 -0400
From: Kurt Feltenberger <kurt@blazenet.net>
Subject: Re: Lucan the Man...

At 03:45 PM 10/13/1999 +0100, you wrote:


>Alan Bradley wrote:
>
> > I've never quite worked out how Norris' fleets got burned so badly.  Sure,
> > they were stretched dealing with the Vargr and Aslan, and they got into a
> > brawl with the Vilani, but I would have thought that most of these
> > engagements would have tended to involve Cruisers or smaller ships.  I
> > can't really see where the Battle squadrons would have suffered the serious
> > losses that would have occurred to Lucan's and Dulinor's fleets.
>
>Norris had just come out of a the FFW a few years before. I doubt the
>fleets would be back to full strength even after 10 years. He also
>didn't have the corridor fleet in reserve. The Vargr also take double
>the fleet assets, than any other foe, to keep them at bay (the
>corridor fleet was at double strength for this purpose).

Perhaps if he was able to negotiate some sort of agreement with the Zho, 
that would allow him to free most of the resources he needs.  Plus, he does 
have the mothball fleets and considering what the opposition would be able 
to field, it is highly possible that ol' Norris can do a "March to the Core".

Kurt Feltenberger

"To our Country! In her intercourse with foreign nations,
    may she always be in the right, but our country, right or wrong!"
      ~Stephen Decatur


mailto:kurt@blazenet.net

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 10:57:01 -0500
From: "Smart, David J (David)" <dasmart@lucent.com>
Subject: Gas-Powered Computers?

No, not gasoline-powered.

Chemist Drives Gas-Powered Computers
(10/14/99, 7:29 a.m. ET)
By Madeleine Acey, TechWeb 

A super-fast molecular computer driven by
gases could solve the scalability problems
posed by the physical limitations of silicon.
Berlin-based chemist James La Clair has
developed molecules that can be switched
between two states (such as "one" and
"zero") by nitrogen and carbon dioxide,
New Scientist magazine reported on
Thursday.

ObTrav: Just some unusual details for high
tech computers.

[I will *not* post the obvious jokes...]

David

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 12:02:08 -0400
From: Walter Smith <SmithW@HARTWICK.EDU>
Subject: re: Population Growth

Kiri wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
If I had to share him with nine other women, someone's head would roll
eventually.  
<snip>
I know quite a few women who could handle being wife #2 or #3 in a society
where women shared labor; it would mean they'd have some time to do things
for themselves.  I know of no one who would want to be wife #9.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
I don't think the situation would be as much "multiple wives" as "single
sperm donor". The lucky(?) man probably won't form close relationships
with all the women, perhaps not even more than one or two of them.
A close relationship has never been a requirement for starting a baby.
(That's not to say jealousies can't tear the colony apart.)

That's assuming the people involved see an overriding need to make
enough kids to try and keep the colony going. If all we have are some
young adults hoping for rescue, they may not "get practical" before their 
breeding time runs out. As a result, the first generation births would be
limited by whatever social mores the survivors came from - if monogamy
was a strict virtue, you might only see one woman having babies per
man in the colony, if that.

Walt Smith

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 17:25:17 +0100
From: "Trevor, Peter" <Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com>
Subject: RE: Population Growth

Walter Smith wrote:
> Kiri wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> If I had to share him with nine other women, someone's head
> would roll eventually.  
> <snip>
> I know quite a few women who could handle being wife #2 or #3
> in a society where women shared labor; it would mean they'd
> have some time to do things for themselves.  I know of no one
> who would want to be wife #9.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> I don't think the situation would be as much "multiple wives"
> as "single sperm donor". The lucky(?) man probably won't form
> close relationships with all the women, perhaps not even more
> than one or two of them.  A close relationship has never been
> a requirement for starting a baby.  (That's not to say
> jealousies can't tear the colony apart.)

Two examples of 'single sperm donor' are:

- - The Postman by David Brin ... its been so long since I read the
  book I can't remember if its in  the  book  itself  but  it  is
  definately in the film version with  Kevin  Costner.  Including
  covering the jealousy angle.

- - A Boy And His Dog (film) ... an extreme example where the  less
  than willing donor is strapped to a  table  and  apparatus  not
  unlike a cow milking machine drains him dry!

In both cases there was a society with a lack of healthy  fertile
males for breeding.



Regards PLST
"Rome wasn't burned in a day."

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 11:42:44 -0500
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net>
Subject: Re: Population Growth

"Trevor, Peter" wrote:
> 
> Walter Smith wrote:
> > Kiri wrote:
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > If I had to share him with nine other women, someone's head
> > would roll eventually.
> > <snip>
> > I know quite a few women who could handle being wife #2 or #3
> > in a society where women shared labor; it would mean they'd
> > have some time to do things for themselves.  I know of no one
> > who would want to be wife #9.
> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > I don't think the situation would be as much "multiple wives"
> > as "single sperm donor". The lucky(?) man probably won't form
> > close relationships with all the women, perhaps not even more
> > than one or two of them.  A close relationship has never been
> > a requirement for starting a baby.  (That's not to say
> > jealousies can't tear the colony apart.)
> 
> Two examples of 'single sperm donor' are:
> 
> - The Postman by David Brin ... its been so long since I read the
>   book I can't remember if its in  the  book  itself  but  it  is
>   definately in the film version with  Kevin  Costner.  Including
>   covering the jealousy angle.
> 
> - A Boy And His Dog (film) ... an extreme example where the  less
>   than willing donor is strapped to a  table  and  apparatus  not
>   unlike a cow milking machine drains him dry!

Another example is Edward P. Hughes' "Barley Cross" series of stories,
included in several volumes of Pournelle's "There Will Be War" anthology
series.  The workaround instituted by the town involved making the one
fertile male (and later, his fertile son) Lord of the village, and
granting him _droit du seigneur_.  Although the stories don't mention
it, I would assume that weddings were timed to ensure maximum fertility
of the brides in question, since this is a one-shot-only method.
> 
> In both cases there was a society with a lack of healthy  fertile
> males for breeding.

- -- 
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 12:49:09 -0400
From: "Keven R. Pittsinger" <jamstar@accesstoledo.com>
Subject: Re: The Near C Rock Accords II 

> BTW, Roger MacBride Allen had an interesting (and 'legal') variation on
> this in one of his books. The enemy assembled a mass driver in an
> asteroid belt and aimed a lot of *small* (a few kg) projectiles at
> where various orbital facilities would be when the projectiles arrived.

Which book was this?  All I've had the chance to read of him has been the 'Farside Cannon' & the two Shattered Sphere books.

Keven

- -- 
tc++ tm+ tn t4- to ru++ ge+ 3i c+ jt au st- ls pi+ ta+ he+ so- vi zh sy
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                                     Science-Fiction Adventure
                                                     In Reavers' Deep

------------------------------

End of Traveller-digest V1999 #1208
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