Subj: Traveller-digest V1999 #1570
Date: 12/23/99 7:36:32 PM Pacific Standard Time
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Traveller-digest Thursday, December 23 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 1570
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.
All rights reserved.
The following topics are covered in this digest:
Re: Drawing Program
Re: England
Re: [OT] War of 1812
Re: Why use .jpg?
Re: [OT] War of 1812
Gunnery, Man or Machine?
Re: OT: FW: moderator: America, as seen by a Canadian
Re: Gone for the holidays, and 1yr anniversary
Re: England
Re: In Jokes
Re: 3I Sports
Re: Drawing Program
Re: Terran polities
Re: Hiding education
Re: Aslan (no longer Re: England)
Re: [OT] War of 1812
Re: Gunnery, Man or Machine?
Re: Why use .jpg?
Re: Geographical idiocy (
advertising jingles
Re: England
Re: Drawing Program
Re: Gunnery
Re: advertising jingles
Re: Hiding education :was Geographical idiocy...
Re: Hiding education :was Geographical idiocy ..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 20:45:29 -0600
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net
Subject: Re: Drawing Program
On 12/23/99 at 08:57 AM, shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson) said:
>In mail you write:
>> ...and if you're really cheap, you can go looking for...
>>
>> 1. an old DOS program called TheDraw. It draws in ASCII. I
>> wouldn't want to do deckplans that way, but I have done simple floorplans
>I have TheDraw. I also have AcidDraw which is actually still supported.
>Both are intended for constructing "screens" for BBSes, though they'd
>likely work ok for the "text only" elements of web pages.
Yes, TheDraw certainly does, and that's where I first ran into TheDraw,
for screens on my BBS. I haven't seen AcidDraw.
Eris
- --
- -----------------------------------------------------------
eris@pcola.gulf.net using MR/2 ICE #245
- -----------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 20:39:53 -0600
From: "Thomas Vickers"
Subject: Re: England
>ISTR the Dresden Firestorm killed more people in a night than both the
>nuclear attacks on Japan combined.
>
>NB
The Tokyo Firebombings killed more than the nukes I think. Pretty easy to
drop incendiaries on wooden buildings really muck things up.
TV
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 20:59:23 -0600
From: Black ICE
Subject: Re: [OT] War of 1812
"Jason T. Barnabas" wrote:
>
> SFC Groth wrote:
>
> > Leonard Erickson wrote:
> > >
> > > In mail you write:
> > >
> > > > I have been known to. Very often if they do get them,
> > > > they serve as important clues. I have had groups chase
> > > > after the elusive Crimson Clupeidae or the Scarlet
> > > > AleWife for months, even years (of game time).
> >
> > Did they have to chop down any trees with either of those?
>
> How do you chop down trees with someone else's starship?
>
> Oh, I didn't make it clear that those are names of starships,
> did I. Sorry. They both were.
>
> Has anyone figured out what significance such a ship
> would have?
Obviously I caught it. If you recall your Monty Python and the Holy
Grail, you'll understand my question....
- --
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 21:57:59 -0500
From: "David J. Golden"
Subject: Re: Why use .jpg?
At 06:40 pm 12/23/99 -0800, you wrote:
>smallest and delete the other one. The disadvantage to
>.gif is that it is limited to 256 colors max, but for most
>things 256 colors is plenty. For simple deck plans, 2
.PNG (portable network graphics) is the replacement for .GIF--it's a
non-lossy compressed image format, which allows full-color (24-bit)
images. 'Course, older browsers won't display it ...
- -- As Dick Cavett put it so eloquently many years ago, "If violence
in TV and movies causes violence in the world, how come we don't see
random acts of situation comedy breaking out on the streets?"
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 14:00:43 +1100
From: "Jim & Peta Lawrie"
Subject: Re: [OT] War of 1812
>> > > I have been known to. Very often if they do get them,
>> > > they serve as important clues. I have had groups chase
>> > > after the elusive Crimson Clupeidae or the Scarlet
>> > > AleWife for months, even years (of game time).
>>
>> Did they have to chop down any trees with either of those?
>
>How do you chop down trees with someone else's starship?
>
>Oh, I didn't make it clear that those are names of starships,
>did I. Sorry. They both were.
>
>Has anyone figured out what significance such a ship
>would have?
>
>--
>Jason
Ahhh, the famous "Red Herring" class. Built at Snark enterprises using
the best Maguffin drives. I especially like the "Goose Pursuit" model.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 19:03:02 -0800 (PST)
From: Kyle Schuant
Subject: Gunnery, Man or Machine?
The example was given of Han and Luke in SW manually
firing... it may be wondered why (apart from dramatic
reasons) a technology that can produce artificial
intelligence like C3-PO can't make a gunnery computer
that fires straight. Well, according to SW canon, they
can, they just don't trust their machines with their
lives. Especially after an incident where an entire
automated fleet disappeared and never came back...
They just don't trust their machines with their
lives... Thus, Gunnery Skill lives on.
=====
KA Schuant
member: Chef's Guild International, Sporting Shooter's Assoc, Amnesty Int, Carlton Soccer Club
Melbourne
Australia
"Duct tape is like the Force: it has a light side, a dark side, and it binds the universe together"
_________________________________________________________
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------------------------------
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 22:16:11 -0500
From: Steve Noe
Subject: Re: OT: FW: moderator: America, as seen by a Canadian
"Walter G. Smith" wrote:
>
> I got this from my brother, and it seemed interesting considering the
> current War of 1812 OT-isness.
[snip]
> This was posted to the '49 list by John Maurer '49.
>
> Joe Gilbreth '49
> ---------------------------------
>
> AMERICA
>
> This comes from a Canadian newspaper about America. A remarkable
> editorial broadcast from Toronto by Gordon Sinclair, a Canadian
> television commentator. What follows is the full text of his trenchant
> remarks as printed in the Congressional Record:
>
[snip]
Ummn...this was broadcast during 1970-71, when Gordon Sinclair was with
CKLW in Windsor, Ontario - you know, the city that's _south_ of Detroit.
Steve Noe, in Indianapolis, who didn't attend Woodstock, 'cause the
music was better at the Ann Arbor Blues Festival, and so was the weather.
fusilier@mindspring.com
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 02:52:58 -0000
From: "Nick Bradbeer"
Subject: Re: Gone for the holidays, and 1yr anniversary
>Take one 25 lb bag charcoal.
>Soak with a couple liters LOX.
>Drop match on it from a _distance_.
NOOOOOOOO!!! This is a Very Bad Plan.
Take the charcoal, place a lighted cigarette/taper/whatever on top of it,
then pour on the LOX from a remotely-triggered container.
If you pre-soak the briquettes with LOX, they explode. One charcoal
briquette soaked in LOX has explosive power roughly equivalent to a stick of
dynamite.
Don't try this at home, kids. I prefer you with all your arms and legs.
Nick
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 02:59:34 -0000
From: "Nick Bradbeer"
Subject: Re: England
>Doesn't what uniforms the bodies are wearing, what matters is whose flag
>gets planted on top of the heap.
Is that really the important thing?
(I'm not saying you're wrong, certainly not in a Realpolitik sense.)
NB
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 03:08:03 -0000
From: "Nick Bradbeer"
Subject: Re: In Jokes
>>ObObTrav: Does anyone else pepper their Traveller universes with all
manner
>>of in-jokes that nobody will ever get?
>
> In my PbEM all my friends get cameos as NPCs, some of the guys get it
>but a lot of the players think that the characters are too wierd to be good
>NPCs.
> Jim.
The entire NPC crew of the RSS Alexander E. Campbell is made up of people I
know. (In fact, the only one with a name change was the captain, and he had
his surname (Taylor) moved to forename, and his mother's maiden name (Bowes)
as his surname. It just sounded cooler that way.)
Nick
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 16:18:06 +1300
From: "Frank Pitt"
Subject: Re: 3I Sports
> On 12/23/99 at 07:38 AM, cos 90 said:
>
> >Sounds a lot like Rollerball, alright, but Rollerball itself was based on
> >a short story called "Rollerball Murder", by William Harroson, first
> >published in 1973; Harrison also wrote the movie screenplay. As for
> >cyberpunk, many point to John Brunner's "The Shockwave Rider" as the
> >first cypberpunk book; like "Killerbowl", it was published in 1975, so
> >which came first is a toss-up. :)
>
> Really? "Shockwave Rider" as cyberpunk? Hum.... I wouldn't have made
> that connection, but I can see it.
Yeah, although it's not really "punk" and is a little too optimisitic,
'Shockwave Rider' certainly feels like cyberpunk because of the way the
computers are used.
The fun thing about 'Shockwave Rider' is that Brunner predicted computer
viruses, before they actually existed (though it may have been close, when
was the Internet Worm released ?), he just got the _name_ wrong, calling
them "phages", which I believe may be a much more biologically accurate
description.
It would certainly be what I'd call "proto-cyberpunk"
There's a book out there called "The Tommorrow File" whose author I can
never remember, which also has that sort of feel to it.
Combined with other things comming out of Englansd at the time, such as the
TV series "The Guardians", and that one that starred Edward Woodward(not
'Callan', though that was a good series in it''s own right), and "The
Analyst" starring Hwyll WhatsHisFace, I'd say that the English "cyberpunk"
movement kicked off before the US one, much like punk itself.
Damn, now you've got me free associating old UK TV Shows now, anyone
remember "Heart of Darkness" ? And the "sequel" about BSE, which came out
before the big BSE scare ?
And "Survivors"....
> You know, I don't think "Jagged Orbit", "Stand on Zanzibar" and "Shockwave
> Rider" have ever gotten the credit they deserved.
I'd put "The Sheep Look Up" over "Jagged Orbit" myself, but they are all
amazing.
Possibly I like it because of the last few lines :
Opening the door to the visiting doctor, all set to apologize for the flour
on her hands - she had been baking - Mrs. Byrne sniffed. Smoke! And if she
could smell it with her heavy head cold, it must be a tremendous fire!
"We ought to call the brigade!" she exclaimed. "Is it a hayrick?"
"The brigade would have a long way to go" the doctor told her curtly. "It's
from America. The wind's blowing that way."
> I thought Brunner was a genius.
I agree completely. Even his knock-off potboilers such as "The Stone That
Never Came Down" and things he wouldn't even put his name to, such as "Into
the Slave Nebula" have a certain touch of class that very few other authors
manage.
"Slave Nebula" would make a great Trav story too, though the plot may be too
obvious for roleplayers.
Frankie
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 21:14:19 -0600
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net
Subject: Re: Drawing Program
On 12/23/99 at 02:51 PM, "David J. Golden" said:
>AAAHHHH! It's time for yet another Topic That Shall Not Die ...
>"exchangeable" graphics formats!
>Nevertheless, I'll throw my two cents in (actually, three or more):
>- JPG is the worst possible format for anything but full-range
>photographs. Line drawings, especially, need to be saved in a non-lossy
>format. (Technical details: JPG converts blocks of pixels from the
>spatial (x,y, RGB) domain into the frequency domain (i.e. a series of
>cosine functions that approximate the RGB value at each original x,y),
>and then throws away higher frequency values. Hence, fine details get
>lost or blurred across multiple pixels).
JPG for photos and very little else...right?
>- There *is* no standard vector format. Most modern programs can read
>DXF, CGM, WMF and PS with varying levels of fidelity, depending on
>platform.
This is a real problem, in my experience. It appears that CAD programs
tend toward DXF, drawing programs tend toward CGM, and Microsoft pushes
WMF. I've run into situations werer I had to save in DXF in one program
load into another save it there as an EPS, then load into a third program
where I worked on it saving it there as a CGM.
>- My choice: I want three copies of *everything*: the artist's original
>format whatever it is (preserve maximum fidelity, and hope I can read
>it), WMF or DXF (for a close vector approximation that allows me to
>effectively scale and edit it), and .PNG or .GIF as the "most portable
>least editable."
At least three! I know they eat up space, but a BMP copy is good to
have around too. I have to send some of my drawings through a BMP step to
get them from CGM to GIF.
Jim, if you can get your drawings into Paint, save them as GIF's, they
will look better. And, yes, I know the legal downside of the GIF format.
I'd be using PNG if I could.
Eris
- --
- -----------------------------------------------------------
eris@pcola.gulf.net using MR/2 ICE #245
- -----------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 19:17:02 -0800 (PST)
From: Glenn Goffin
Subject: Re: Terran polities
>From: "Kiri Aradia Morgan"
> Morgan is a fairly common last name.
I've just assumed you were a descendant of the famous
pirates Henry and J.P. Morgan.
- --Glenn
_________________________________________________________
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------------------------------
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 19:20:15 -0800 (PST)
From: Glenn Goffin
Subject: Re: Hiding education
>From: "Douglas E. Berry"
>Well, Saturday morning cartoons don't really exist as
>they did in the Good Old Days... Get up at 0700 with
>a bowl of Frosted Flakes and remain tied to the tube
>until noon.
"Three bowls of Double-Frosted Chocolate Bombs and
I'll be hyperactive and incoherent all day!"
- --Calvin, to Hobbes, in front of the tv on a Saturday
morning
- --Glenn
_________________________________________________________
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------------------------------
Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 03:16:29 -0000
From: "Nick Bradbeer"
Subject: Re: Aslan (no longer Re: England)
>Clear something up for me, please. The Aslan male has a territorial
>imperitive...they need land. Okay, but how *much* land to they really
>need? Would a 40 acre wood be enough, or do they need a tract the size of
>Rhode Island? Would ownership of an entire moon, a tract of land on a
>vacuum world, or a 100 sq km space habitat be acceptable?
It's a question of status. An aslan male's status (and the status of his
family) is directly connected to the amount of land he controls. The ihatei
owning a 40 acre wood would spend his whole life planning to get more. The
owner of Rhode Island may or may not be happy. And most male aslan would
probably do *anything* to own an entire planetoid.
Nick
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 03:18:01 -0000
From: "Nick Bradbeer"
Subject: Re: [OT] War of 1812
>Obviously I caught it. If you recall your Monty Python and the Holy
>Grail, you'll understand my question....
"We demand that you chop down the mightiest tree in the forrest with
a........herring!"
-The knights who say
'ecky-echy-echy-hu-tang-wop-fwee-dom-ni', MP&THG
NB
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 03:20:03 -0000
From: "Nick Bradbeer"
Subject: Re: Gunnery, Man or Machine?
>lives. Especially after an incident where an entire
>automated fleet disappeared and never came back...
Didn't the Katana's just suddenly decide that they liked independance better
than the Empire? (It's been a while since I read SW background-type
stuff...)
Nick
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 20:23:43 -0700 (MST)
From: Merrick Burkhardt
Subject: Re: Why use .jpg?
Jason is exactly right.
Continuous tone images (ie: photographs) should be jpegs. Line art
should be gif. In fact, for something like a deckplan it will just
about always look better in GIF unless you use minimum compression
on your jpeg.
3d rendered images can go both ways depending on how complext they
are (as they get more photo-real, they need jpeging). There are a
few sites online that will also optimize your gifs for you to minimize
file size--they are really cool:
http://www.gifwizard.com/
that's the only one I have offhand... try it, it's cool!
- -Merrick
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 21:22:10 -0600
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net
Subject: Re: Geographical idiocy (
On 12/23/99 at 01:04 PM, Bruce Johnson
said:
>Thomas Vickers wrote:
>>
>> Its tough to teach kids geography, they hate it. I only have to teach Texas
>> geography in my job, but it still takes for too long for them to get it.
>> After nine months of Texas history, most of them can't figure out where
>> Houston is and we only live about 30 miles away.
>Yeah, but Texas has 3,234 little counties all over the place (anyone ever
>_seen_ a county map of Texas? ;-) Jeez, the county sherf probably leaves
>his jurisdiction backing out of his driveway!
Tom, doesn't have to teach them *all* the counties! But his
students *should* be able to look at a map of their state and pick out two
or three of the largest cities, the state capital and where they live.
They should also know the names of their local legislators (state and
federal), Governor, and President. They should know what the six flags
over Texas are, and why they are important. And......I better stop now.
>guess I was a nerd even in grade school (well, duh!) I liked geography:
>we always got neat little blank maps to draw on, which started a long,
>and ongoing fascination with things cartographic...
Yeah, I was the same way. Thing is, though, *all* the students in grade
school back in the dark ages when I was that young had to do those maps,
and recite the states and capitals, and the Presidents, and...no we didn't
have to do it in latin.
Eris
- --
- -----------------------------------------------------------
eris@pcola.gulf.net using MR/2 ICE #245
- -----------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 19:26:40 -0800 (PST)
From: Glenn Goffin
Subject: advertising jingles
>From: "Douglas E. Berry"
>Subject: Re: Hiding education
>>Does the Silly Era page have any advertising
>>jingles?
>Not *yet*
>That is a challenge folks.. let's hear some
>advertising jingles for Famile Spofulam or General
>Products.
Gen'ral Products, Gen'ral Products,
Gen'ral all the way
Oh what fun it is to buy
General Products all day!
why am I doing this? I'm probably the least
musically-inclined member of the list.
- --Glenn
_________________________________________________________
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Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 19:28:59 -0800 (PST)
From: Glenn Goffin
Subject: Re: England
>From: "Nick Bradbeer"
>ISTR the Dresden Firestorm killed more people in a
>night than both the nuclear attacks on Japan
combined.
I think that is true of the fire bombing of Tokyo as
well.
- --Glenn
_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 22:30:22 -0500
From: "David J. Golden"
Subject: Re: Drawing Program
At 09:14 pm 12/23/99 -0600, you wrote:
>On 12/23/99 at 02:51 PM, "David J. Golden"
said:
>JPG for photos and very little else...right?
Basically ... it's for full-range images where slight variations
from pixel to pixel can be reduced without significant overall loss
of visual quality.
>At least three! I know they eat up space, but a BMP copy is
good to
>have around too. I have to send some of my drawings through a BMP
step to
>get them from CGM to GIF.
But once you've got PNG or GIF, you can create any other
pixel-oriented format without loss of information. Assuming, of
course, you have a conversion program. And it'd be a very poor
program that couldn't handle a conversion from PNG or GIF to BMP ...
- -- As Dick Cavett put it so eloquently many years ago, "If violence
in TV and movies causes violence in the world, how come we don't see
random acts of situation comedy breaking out on the streets?"
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 19:32:56 -0800 (PST)
From: Glenn Goffin
Subject: Re: Gunnery
>From: "Nick Bradbeer"
>IIRC, The T4 Naval Architect's handbook I never
>undertood that one. To quote:
>"...and the workstation turns and banks along with
>the weapon."
>Now, maybe it's me, but I had this crazy idea the
>spinal mount was so called because it was about two
>hundred metres long and embedded firmly into the
>spine of the ship. And if the ship turns, the weapon
>stations turns with it. Can anyone throw in a
>plausible explanation
That's my understanding, too.
Well, if the ship turns and the weapon turns with it,
then the weapon workstation turns with the weapon and
the ship.
- --Glenn
_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 21:38:15 -0600
From: Black ICE
Subject: Re: advertising jingles
Glenn Goffin wrote:
>
> >From: "Douglas E. Berry"
<>
> >That is a challenge folks.. let's hear some
> >advertising jingles for Famile Spofulam or General
> >Products.
>
> Gen'ral Products, Gen'ral Products,
> Gen'ral all the way
> Oh what fun it is to buy
> General Products all day!
>
> why am I doing this? I'm probably the least
> musically-inclined member of the list.
Which makes you eminently suited to write advertising jingles....
- --
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 13:49:37 +1000
From: "The Roc"
Subject: Re: Hiding education :was Geographical idiocy...
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Mark Urbin
To:
Sent: Thursday, December 23, 1999 11:59 PM
Subject: Hiding education :was Geographical idiocy
>
> My kids learned the Animanics song listing the states & capitals.
> This was not their only source of education though. :-)
> One is going to school at the serious place of higher learning down the
road
> from where Kenji is hanging out.
"Yakko's America?" My kids know that song off by heart too!!!
"Cheyenne is in Wyomin' and perhaps you make your home in,
Salt Lake City out in Utah, where the buffalo roam;
Atlanta's down in Georgia; and there's Bismark North Dakota;
and you can live in Frankfurt in your old Kentucky home..."
Not all that handy to 4x Aussie kids??? But they also know "Yakko's World"
with all the countries listed, much handier :^)
I personally like "The Ballad of Magellan"
- -- The Roc
"Whoopie ti-yi-yo
Strong brave Magellan
You'll find the East Indies
You Just don't know where..."
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 13:51:40 +1000
From: "The Roc"
Subject: Re: Hiding education :was Geographical idiocy ..
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Trevor, Peter
To:
Sent: Friday, December 24, 1999 1:01 AM
Subject: RE: Hiding education :was Geographical idiocy
> Mark Urbin wrote:
> > My kids learned the Animanics song listing the states & capitals.
> > This was not their only source of education though. :-)
>
> "Its off to the movies, we will go
> To learn everything that we know...
>
You can get it on CD too! ;^)
------------------------------
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #1570
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